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Welcome back to another problem with Video today we're going to be tackling The bat family again and as much as I Would love to tackle Barbara Gordon I'm Going to be talking about Nightwing What's the problem with Nightwing so When it comes to Nightwing what I Consider to be the problems at Nightwing Some of you might disagree with and That's going to make for an interesting Video because I know that all of you Have done nothing but wholeheartedly Fully agreed with every one of my points In the previous videos there is not a Single negative comment in existence on Those videos at least that's what Dan Has told me and shown me but anyway Today we're going to be looking at the Problem with Dick Grayson because the Problem is Batman now some of you are Going to disagree with that but in order To get into explaining why Batman is Dick Grayson's problem we need to Understand who Dick Grayson and Nightwing actually are fun fact did you Know that there have been more than one Nightwing and I'm not talking Jason Todd Putting on the costume temporarily I'm Talking that Nightwing has technically Taken the name from other superheroes I've got the full list up here now I Always assumed that Nightwing and Flamebird were just two superheroes on Krypton that was a story that Superman
Had told Dick Grayson as a child so he Took the name of Nightwing and that's Where I thought the story ended but Apparently it got used multiple multiple Times in krypton's lore in Superman Books so apparently back in 1963 Superman and Jimmy Olsen got stranded in Candor and they decided to take the Names of Nightwing and flamebird as Their official superhero titles they had A night cave a nightmobile and basically Did a whole thing but it's a it's a Pre-crisis insane storyline now as far As I know that was pretty much the story Which did get changed a little bit when He was telling it to Dick Grayson where He explained that there was another Superhero named Nightwing but when I Looked up Nightwing on the wiki to make Sure I didn't miss any key points There's a character named Van Z that Took up the title of Nightwing and Flamebird and it was basically Superman's look-alike second cousin Surprise that person's not still around Because we got a entire super family Anyway and then Dick Grayson took up the Title but following post-crisis there's Also Superman Man of Steel number 100 And 11 where Superman and Lois go to a Different version of Krypton where they Become Nightwing inflame bird there's a Character named Tad rystad who went to Bloodhaven and he's a sociopath who
Becomes a version of Nightwing Jason Todd takes the role between 118 to 122 To murder people as Nightwing power girl And Supergirl take the titles of Nightwing and flamebird when they go to Kandor so apparently the name Nightwing Gets used more than references to Nightwings but but as far as I'm Concerned there's been a lot of them but That's not really why we're here also Apparently there's a person named Cheyenne Fremont just before you crazies Who are going to go down and be like too Benny uh Cheyenne Fremont's a person uh Chris Kent took over the title of Nightwing at one point in alternate Realities we have the tangent Comics Nightwing which is a secret government Organization that appears throughout the Comics headed by Marcus Moore and Francis Black Lightning Powell who acted To protect the US and conceal the true Nature of the Adam's involvement in the Cuban Missile Crisis What anyway oh and one final one uh Terry McGinnis moonlighted as Nightwing And Batman Beyond number four Don't know why not gonna look into it Because it doesn't matter because Today's the problem with Dick Grayson Anyway moving on to Dick Grayson now Richard John Dick Grayson talk about a Long name that none of us knew probably Existed to how many of you guys knew
That Richard's middle name was John and It's not dick also I'm not gonna look it Up because I want somebody to tell me Why is Dick shorthand for Richard I've Never understood that one but anyway he Was from the flying graysons his family Gets involved depending on your Continuity his family is involved with The mob or the mob is trying to get back At the uh the circus something leads to The Mob members killing dick Grayson's Parents Batman adopts him and then Trains him as the new Rob and he's the Flying acrobat and the idea behind Robin In Batman was that Batman was brooding Batman was sad Batman wanted to just Take Vengeance out on the city but Dick Grayson was the lighthearted hope of Batman he was the Ying to the Yang he Was the way to kind of like spice up the Batman lore by adding a young brightly Colored child to the adventure roster Which back in the 50s and when was he Actually introduced they uh originally In April of 1940 so in the 40s and 50s The idea of a vigilante superhero seemed Very popular at the time no one Questioned why Batman's adopting these Like 14 year old kids and bring them out I know we occasionally bring it up Nowadays but the fact of the matter is Let's ignore that because it's comic Books anyway so basically what happened Is Robin slash Dick Grayson was used as
An analog for kids to be able to relate To comic books that was the original Idea that was the concept behind having Sidekicks Batman's this big adult he's Got a ton of money he's a cool superhero But kids can't relate to that but you Know what they can relate to a young kid Who's teaming up with Batman and having Access to all of his stuff this Eventually led to there being the Teen Titans Dick Grayson leading that uh the Original roster was Aqualad Kid Flash And Robin that was it that was your Teen Titans in 1964. that eventually moves Dick Grayson into leading the Titans Because they eventually age up because In case you forgot comic books actually Aged and progressed early on I've said This in another video but every Character in the DC and Marvel Universe Was allowed to age and move on except For the popular ones Bruce Wayne always Had to go back to being around his 30s And be Bruce Wayne but characters like Dick Grayson did age he went from being A Teen Titan to being a Titan to being Dick Grayson because he was a period Where he wasn't Nightwing to taking up The mantle of Nightwing and becoming Nightwing these characters progress and Yes technically that probably would have Been a 10-year span of time and they Spread it out over the course of 60 Years but once again this is comics and
We allow for the rolling time scale so Officially Nightwing started up his First official book in 1995 in a comic Book that I didn't know existed called Nightwing Alfred's return now he did Take over as Nightwing back in the Teen Titans Judas contract that was the Official event in which he became Nightwing but he was just a member of Teen Titans and Titans before having his Own official book once again Nightwing Was allowed to grow and evolve and Become a new care character and go in a Different direction so officially at That point 1995 and onward he went over To bloodhaven and became officially Nightwing and they had a couple Miniseries and they had a couple things Focused on him but he didn't have a long Ongoing series just about yet it was in 1996 after his miniseries being such a Successor they decided to give him his Own series now like I said other than Key characters who are always going to Be cash crabs like Batman Superman Wonder Woman other characters within the DC Universe and the Marvel Universe are Allowed to grow and evolve and become Something else and that's what was going On with Nightwing he went from being Robin to being a Teen Titan to Leading The Teen Titans I think he technically LED them the whole time but either way Eventually becoming Nightwing and now
Getting his own Series where he was Protecting bloodhaven and beginning to Grow on his own this whole series was Basically kind of what we have now in Donna DC what I was going to say rebirth It's the series that's been going on Since rebirth but now I think it's the Donna DC era but basically fighting Against Blockbuster discovering the Zukos doing murder mysteries basically The same concept as to what's happening Right now he didn't get involved in no Man's land where he was bouncing back And forth between bloodhaven and Gotham Helping out with Batman to helping do a Bunch of stuff over there while Maintaining bloodhaven eventually Apparently at some point in the middle Of this and I'm sure my brother read This series but he took over with the Replacement League because the the I Gotta find this story but I guess the Justice League got thrown back in time And they were fighting some wizard in The past so they needed a replacement Justice League and Nightwing ran to that League I've never even heard of that Story I'm not gonna lie to you guys I'm Looking at this thing like okay Recognize that I love no man's land uh Justice League went in the past and Fought a wizard what the hell like that That was my reaction to reading that he Took over as the leader there Batman
Gave him his accommodations when he came Back all of this eventually leads up to A lot of Nightwing development and him Growing as a character until eventually Batman is killed so in final crisis Batman gets shot by the Omega beams his Corpse is replaced by the corpse of a Clone of Batman and the real Batman is Sent at a doctor who Adventure where he Goes through time trying to figure out What his history was but as far as the DC Universe was concerned Batman was Dead so Dick Grayson took over becoming Batman now this sent an interesting spin Into The Narrative of Batman and Robin Because at this point we now had Damien And at this point if you had watched my Damian video Damien was officially Robin To Dick Grayson's Batman so Dick Grayson Quippy fun hopeful Batman Damien Wayne There's no polite way to say this he's a Little dick he's just a little Dick Grayson but not in a hopeful way don't Get me demonetization he's just uh he's Just a little butt head is what he is Okay he's just he's just a little butt Head and he was like the mean the Brooding the Assassin then you got Dick Grayson the hopeful the amount of times That I have to say dick in this video I Really hope they don't catch us for it Dick is a name YouTube Dick is a name Anyway we have Batman and Robin doing Their things and that's what I mean by
The problem with Dick Grayson is Batman This was The Ultimate Evolution for a Character he went from being a kid who Had a similar situation to Bruce Wayne Losing his parents to being the hopeful Kid giving hope to Batman and the bat Family to running his own portion of the City to becoming Batman Proper like evolution of him and now This is back before I became doing comic Story and stuff so I was reading stuff For fun and I wasn't aware that he even Randall Justice League at this point or At least he was the Batman on the Justice League I don't think he ran it I Think it was more Superman at this point But like I said this is back in like 2008 2009 I was in Iraq at this time I Was reading comic books when I could get My hands on them so I missed a couple of These things but yeah he became Batman And then the new 52 hit and that's when Our problems that Dick Grayson started Now it's not a quiet fact that Dan Dio The guy who was in charge at the time Was not a fan of Dick Grayson or Nightwing he for some reason did not Like the Titans didn't want them around Didn't want that Evolution I think it Had something to do with the fact that The big money makers were Batman Superman Wonder Woman and I think he Wanted the Classic roster to be back up There so how Jordan had to come back to
Replace Kyle Raynor although that Happened years prior in a lot of the Blackest Night event and stuff like that It was more prominently featured at this Point because Kyle Rayner complete they Got bumped Wally West got replaced by Barry Allen and Nightwing got fired as Batman when Batman came back from the Dead Nightwing kept going as Batman and Gotham and Batman took over as Batman For Batman Incorporated just so you're Wondering what had happened so up until New 52 Nightwing stayed Batman and Dick Grayson stayed Batman new 52 dropped we Got a brand new origin for Nightwing he Was Nightwing this went on for about 20 25 issues until he was killed by the Crime syndicate of Earth 3 and the Entire world knew that Dick Grayson was Nightwing and was murdered so to go into Hiding he became Grayson a spy for the Agency of spiral which is actually a Really fun reinvention of Dick Grayson But it's not like what we wanted we Wanted Dick Grayson to evolve and become Batman it was always deemed as he's the Batman with hope he's the best thing That Batman can be he's what Batman Should become so him becoming Batman was Perfect but no now he became Nightwing And then he lost the Nightwing title and Became Grayson then that went on for a Little while he came back as Nightwing And I think DC rebirth that lasted for a
Little while then he took a bullet to The head to make Batman sad and became Rick Grayson and I'm not gonna lie and I Don't know who did but I didn't read the Rick Grace and stuff I gave it the first Arc because I was like okay well it's Not gonna last that long it lasted for Like three years guys it was a long Period let me see if I can find the Exact time stamp on how long Rick Grayson lasted okay so I couldn't get You exact date but I can tell you the Issues it started in Batman issue 55 I Think that was the issue we took the Shot and that was around issue 50 of Nightwing which is volume four and then That lasted until the Joker War issue 77. that's how long he stayed Rick Grayson so going off of basic math like Even this guide here that tells you when Rick Grayson happened the phase is known As the Rick Grayson period and is not Recommended So it was Dumb and if you think about Grayson so that would be the equivalent Of 50 to 77 so that would be like 27 Issues or so about that period so that Would be at a minimum two and a half Years if they come out once a month That's assuming for annuals and things Like that so oh my God like that way too Long to have a character the whole idea Of Rick Grayson was he didn't know Dick Grayson was and he didn't know who
Batman was but he knew the bat family so They were giving him money and he was Driving around a cab and since he had Memories of being Nightwing he was Teaching a new batch of Nightwings to be Nightwing while he was just Rick Grayson It was terrible it was a terrible idea I I liked the idea of like a single Arc Thing oh I forgot all my memories I Gotta get them back and then he could be Like well I'm Dick Grayson what made This worse what made this worse is this Is during the period when Alfred died so We have issues where everyone is teaming Up to do the memorial for Alfred and Rick is there and they're like what are You doing here Rick and he's like I Don't know Pretend This is alcohol I I Don't know I I I I my old self seemingly Knew him you knew they had to write Dick Grayson into the finale for Alfred but He couldn't be Rick Grayson it was it Was terrible it was a terrible idea so Anyway that entered into the ERA with Tom Taylor and Tom Taylor is the first Guy to write Dick Grayson since DC Rebirth that feels like he knows what Nightwing should be and now Nightwing is Progressing to the point where he is Apparently going to take over as the Leader of the Titans again he kind of Half has been like if you read a Titan's Book he's been the leader of the Titans But then whenever you would read a
Nightwing book that it wasn't a thing Like at all like it just didn't get Mentioned or talked about or anything Tom Taylor is doing this amazing job of Doing the ultimate Dick Grayson in my Opinion and it we've covered it here on The channel and I'll link it down below Because he moved Dick Grayson back to Bloodhaven put him back in a spot put Him up against Blockbuster again and Then started the reminders that dick Grayson's whole idea is that he's Batman With friends Batman with hope better Batman so he's now dating Barbara Gordon Again he's teaming up with the Titans if Something goes wrong in the city he Calls them why does Batman never call People the Fail-Safe Arc just happened And you know what happened the Batman's Losing and he didn't call the bat family They all just showed up as far as I can Remember I doubt there was a phone call And it's the problem with Batman's Character is I can almost guarantee you There wasn't a phone call it wasn't like That yo Tim Tim yo call Barbara get dick Out here okay you know go go find where Wherever we put Duke go put him uh we Got Katana we got Black Lightning uh get Ghost maker there's like five members of The Batman Incorporated going on right Now uh Jason's probably here I don't Know where he's at but someone's gotta Have his phone number I think Stephanie
Does you know what call Stephanie call Orphan get them out here call the league Too why don't you man that'd be great That doesn't happen although it'd be Hilarious just to see Batman run around With the bat phone like calling up Everybody going through his speed dial Hal Jordan Hal Jordan Hal Jordan I like That would be so cool anyway I digress Nightwing is being written properly Because he has friends he has the money He has the bat family he has everything Finally going for him and since dark Crisis we're now building him to kind of Be basically the leader of the Justice League but the Justice League is going To be the Titans so it doesn't really It's not really the Justice League but They're the premier team going out there Right now so the problem with Nightwing To come back to the beginning of this Video is Batman to hit his final Evolution his final form Batman needs to Be gone and it worked because what Happened is Batman died and he became Batman so then we had Dick Grayson and Bruce Wayne now I'm all for Nightwing Becoming his own superhero in his own Right but I feel that kind of ruins the Original idea of Dick Grayson because Dick Grayson was supposed to be the Better side of Batman growing into Batman and Tada we're done but ever Since New 52 our superheroes have spun
In this circle like it used to just be People like the Trinity people who Needed movies so Batman's got movies Superman's got movies they've always got To go back to their status quo but we Can age and change other characters Wally West can go from being Kid Flash To the flash Dick Grayson can go from Being Robin to Nightwing to Batman we Can do things like that and they can be Fine as long as you're cool with Batman Superman and Wonder Woman not changing But ever since the new 52 no one's Changing or revolving or what they're All going back to a stat this quo and It's weird because it's the entire Universe and because of that Nightwing Is just Nightwing now I like the Direction that Tom Taylor is taking him Now but I still wish for the day when he Puts on that cowl he becomes Nightwing Dick Grayson Nightwing this is The guy we all want you know well Becomes Batman with the you know what I'm saying you know what I'm saying okay Dan's looking at me like you just called Him Nightwing and your whole point of Your thing was to call him Batman and You're right it's what I wanted but We're just so used to calling him Nightwing man anyway what do you guys Think about the whole situation with Dick Grace and Batman Nightwing because I think that's the issue we're running
Into right now and I would love for Bruce Wayne to be off the board again Him become Batman and we move back in That direction but I'm okay with him Becoming the leader of the Titans and The Titans becoming the new Justice League that's cool too but it's still Not what I wanted but at this point I'm Just gonna ramble more so than ever Because Nightwing is not as it's weird It's really weird at Nightwing because When you think of Nightwing you think of Someone that's been in the DC Universe Since the dawn of time and you're not Wrong but Nightwing hasn't been around Since the mid 80s and Nightwing hasn't Had a comic since the 1995s and Nightwing was retired around the Mid-2000s so Nightwing himself as Actually not had that much time as you In the whole scheme of things from a Character who's been introduced in the 1940s so that's why I think for me Knowing the full history of him I just Want him to become Batman because for a Character that went from kid to Robin to Leader to Teen Titans to leader of the Titans to Nightwing to Batman and then Back to Nightwing then back to No Name Then back to somebody named Rick Grayson That nobody wants to talk about it feels Like we've done nothing but regress him Until Tom Taylor took over which is into The leaping into the light and I think
It started at issue 78 so I highly Recommend it anyway I'll give you all The videos of those links down below the Links to those videos down below not the Videos to the links that would be weird The links to the videos down below uh And if you like these kinds of videos Let me know in the comments like Subscribe hit that notification Bell and I'll see you next time right here at the Problem with I'm looking at Joker Maybe Or maybe we can get back to tackling Barbara Gordon What's the problem with Nightwing Trying something new didn't work
